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‘Half of Brits watch porn on unregulated sites since age verification crackdown’

2d 8h ago by lemmy.world/u/CAVOK in europe@feddit.org from www.independent.co.uk

Wait... criminalisation doesn't work and just makes unregulated and black markets grow?

Who would have thought?

Yes but we were righteous about it this time, it should have worked!?

Username checks out

Wait... You mean the experts warning that this exact thing would happen were right?

Who would have thought? Surely not the experts!

The UK now that all the children are safe from watching porn

Only half?

The other half lied.

I assume that, given the focus of the article --- whether or not Britons are going to sketchier sites or not than they had been prior to the legislation coming into force --- that this number doesn't include users who are simply using a VPN or Tor or similar to ignore restrictions on regulated sites doing IP-based geoblocking.

Stupid fucking backwards law. I was watching cheeks get clapped on the internet from the moment I knew what sex was. It didn't do me any harm.

As it has been said many times before, it's totally about control rather than safety.

Love this take. I get a similar one from my mom sometimes when I mention her smoking:

"I smoked around you constantly and you didn't end up any worse off for it."

Do you really think that consistent porn usage from a very young age has no harms at all?

Are you really comparing watching something, to the physical action of smoking?

Do you really think watching porn has no effect on a person? Also I was referring to second-hand smoke.

What's second-hand porn watching? This metaphor doesn't really work.

Its when you jerk off with one hand whilst porning with the other.

Yes it does. Both are examples of something demonstrably bad, and one person saying, "well it didn't negatively affect one person, so it must be fine!"

Not only is a sample size of one useless, but unless OP is claiming to be fully well adjusted with great mental health and no negative feelings towards woman(implicit bias included), and no participation in the patriarchy, they can't really claim to know constant consumption of porn has no negative effect.

All of that existed long before the internet. In fact it was probably worse pre-internet. So the sites could be entirely unrelated.

Kids are going to get exposed to porn no matter what. I do think it has the potential to have some pretty harmful effects on them, but I don't think the answer to that is the Online Safety Act. I don't think this will actually stop kids from stumbling across porn, and I think that putting our heads in the sand and pretending it will is just dumb.

I don't know what would be the best thing to do about this problem, but I do know that the rhetoric around protecting kids is just going to make it less likely that we actually do things that could be useful for supporting kids to have healthy attitudes towards sex.

For instance, I remember that one of the most impactful sites I ever stumbled across as a teenager was an educational website that had loads of pictures of human genitals. Especially as a girl who had already been exposed to porn, it was super useful to see the wide variety of what vulvas can look like.

A depressing number of my peers expressed insecurity over the appearance of their vulvas, and I remember one girl was convinced that she would need to get a labioplasty as an adult because she had more prominent labia minora than she had seen in porn, and didn't realise that her vulva was well within what is normal.

One of my friends expressed anxiety over having sex, because she had been masturbating using cylindrical objects of various sizes, attempting to work up to what she perceived as the average girth of a penis, based on what she'd seen in porn. She was practicing because she was terrified of the size of penises she had seen in porn, and didn't realise that wasn't representative of the average penis size.

As a young adult, once I started having sex, there were a few times when it was abundantly clear that the young man I was with had been heavily influenced by porn, in terms of how they felt they were expected to act.

So many of my peers had their sexual development affected by seeing porn, and better sex education in school could have potentially mitigated some of these harms. However, we won't get productive change in this area as long as we're operating under the prudish "won't someone think of the children" mentality that led to the Online Safety Act. It would be good if we could shield kids from exposure to this stuff, but I don't think that's viable. We need to be more realistic if we actually want to protect kids from harm

I'm alright with making the doors to the local porn shop stickier (no pun intended), but in addition I agree that we need a better understanding of intimacy and sexuality as a society. For some reason its an incredibly taboo subject in western society, and that leaves the extreme religious folks as the only ones talking about it.

I wish this type of discussion was happening in our local government town halls rather than in a corner of the internet most won't ever see.

What’s “funny” is that this law will push users to sites that are exposing them to viruses and scams which directly parallels real for-pay sex when prostitution is illegal and pushing people to unregulated sources that expose them to viruses and scams.

I’m concerned that the sites people are flocking to will not only have less protection for the consumers, but also less protection for the performers. Sites that break the law in one way may be breaking the law in others, such as in regard to whether the actors are being coerced to perform, or are underage.

I know nobody wants to think about the ethics, but those are real concerns that all these laws conveniently forget about. Pushing people to the dark web means they’ll be exposed to some very concerning content.

Yup. I know someone who has revenge porn released of her. When she found it on legit sites, she was able to get it taken down. When she found it on dodgy sites, if she was even able to contact someone from the site, they rarely took it down. One site even had it on their featured videos on the homepage a few days after she emailed, which surely must be a deliberate act of spite

Why is that funny? Its reducing porn usage to a degree which is what they want.

Its reducing porn usage

Not certain this is true.

  1. Brits are watching porn on non-age verification sites, which don't have stats that they have to share with

  2. Brits are bypassing age verification through other means (like VPN).

This is like when America bragged that COVID numbers were low. Because we stopped testing. Funny how that works.

False analogy but I do agree we can't tell for sure if its down. I'm assuming any friction added will reduce access to some degree though.

If kids watching porn is illegal, and providing porn to children is illegal, then its good that we are regulating the legal markets. I don't mind if some fraction of kids decide to find porn via unregulated means.

I think right now the "are you 18?" banners are a joke, and have been for at least 20 years. Restricting porn sites properly or banning them outright, along with educating young people on the risks of pornography, are good ideas to me.

If you don't like the privacy intrusion, get your porn from an unregulated place or stop watching it.

If you don't like porn, don't watch it. Stop forcing your ideals on others.

I was a teenager and the option of not watching it would never have occurred to me. The idea that people accidentally stumble across it and then get hooked is laughable.

And I don't mean adult media uploaded to sites which serve other media, I mean bespoke adult sites. You don't end up there by accident. Anyone who goes there and sees the splash screen will just open another tab and go somewhere less restrictive.

Maybe you should reflect a bit on why you watching porn was some sort of destined even in this world, and what effects it might have on you socially, mentally, and physically.

Teenagers get horny. It's not deep. Humans being horny existed long before the internet

And pornography has existed since... how long ago? Replacing human contact with technology surely hasn't caused problems before. Let's also put a gigantic profit motive behind the technology while we are at it.

Lmao what? You think people are watching less porn because they have to make two clicks instead of one?

Found the politician lol

I think all that porn has messed up your ability to type an argument out.

"backfire"? It's working exactly as intended. Does nothing for the children but the nanny/nazi state foundation is getting stronger.

Now they want to check ages for using VPNs, which is obviously another idiotic thing to do, and would lead to more idiotic laws, until the UK is more restricted than China.

Even in a world where one assumes that they do this --- which the present British government has stated that they are not --- and it is successful and enforce it, then the next problem will be stuff like Tor. No commercial providers involved, so they can't lean on payment processors. Now the British ISPs need to be compelled to try and detect that --- and one can make Tor a lot harder to detect than it presently is, where people just don't care that much --- and block it. Let's imagine that Parliament successfully gets Britain's telecom infrastructure modified and manages to fix all this and enforce it.

If you've got OpenSSH on your computer, any Linux box out there --- which could be a cheap VPS, say --- running SSH is pretty easy to turn into an exit node for a SOCKS5 proxy:

$ ssh -D 1080 <remote host>

Now your local host has a SOCKS5 proxy listening on 127.0.0.1. Tell your browser to use localhost as a SOCKS5 proxy, and all your browser traffic is magically coming from Country X. This Firefox plugin allows toggling use of a proxy on and off by clicking a button in the toolbar, so you can bip on and off as desired.

Okay, now maybe they manage to make it illegal for Britons to obtain access to SSH-capable servers elsewhere in the world.

Then people head over to fully-darknet stuff like Hyphanet. So then you're down to trying to tamp down on a darknet system that, unlike Tor, is already structured to be resistant to state-level censorship that might involve detecting and blocking traffic.

I mean, we can play this game forever, but the practical point here is that there are fundamental, really hard enforceability issues, if you want something beyond political theater. Yeah, okay, some of these things are going to take some technical knowledge, but if there's real demand to use them, it's also not hard for someone to slap a pretty front-end on up and make one-click solutions. Do you make all British Internet access systems trusted, closed, and state-controlled? Do you shift over to trying to punish (by definition, local) people who might view pornography rather than go after some source of pornography somewhere on the Internet outside of British legal jurisdiction? Like, you're talking about a very different world.

North Korea has some success in controlling the information environment that its citizens have access to, but that would involve such a transformation of Britain that I think that it's safe to say that few Britons, no matter how opposed they are to pornography, would likely welcome it, and even there, it's limited:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_in_North_Korea

North Korea forbids the possession, production, distribution and importation of pornography. This is punished harshly by the government. Nevertheless, pornography is widespread in the country because people secretly import it, or locally produce it.

In the past, pornographic videos were also made in North Korea.[1] They began to appear during the leadership of Kim Jong Il,[3] who himself reportedly had a significant collection of pornographic films.[5] Domestic titles were usually immediately seized by the authorities. North Korea has also exported pornography in an effort to gain hard currency. Some of these efforts were through North Korean websites.[6]

Watching pornography became widespread among the country's elites in the late 1990s. Thereafter, the practice has spread to other societal strata as well. Domestic pornographic works usually feature nude or bikini-wearing North Korean women dancing to music. The Literature and Art Publishing Company secretly published a pornographic book, Licentious Stories, for the use of party officials. In 2000, the Korean Central Broadcasting Committee also published a pornographic videotape for officials. Imported pornography has nowadays largely replaced domestic pornography. Political and army elites are the most active consumers of pornography. In 2007 renting a CD for one hour cost 2,000 North Korean won.[7] In 1995, a pornographic film could be sold for as much as 80 dollars. In recent years, prices have fallen dramatically due to increased supply,[8] with one Chinese smuggler stating he regularly hands out porn for free for customers who buy pirated K-dramas.[9]

South Korean pornographic films are smuggled into the country.[10] Propaganda balloons sent from South Korea to the North have featured sexually explicit material to appeal to North Korean soldiers, too.[11] Henry A. Crumpton, a veteran of the Central Intelligence Agency's Directorate of Operations, explains that he has "never met a North Korean diplomat who did not want porn, either for personal use or resale."[12]

The State Security Department is tasked with monitoring illegal imports of pornographic materials. Involvement in illegal import results in the culprit being shot or sent to a kyohwaso (re-education camp) for 10 to 15 years.[16] Executions of several persons accused of watching or distributing pornography took place in late 2013.[17] It is illegal for tourists to bring pornography into the country.[citation needed] Access to "sex and adult websites" on the Internet has been blocked from the country,[18] but in the past BitTorrent downloads of pornography have been detected, likely relating to foreigners residing in Pyongyang.[19] Likewise, North Koreans living near the border with China use mobile phones equipped with Chinese SIM cards to access Chinese porn sites.[20]

Of course, they didn't include the kids they supposedly were protecting in the poll.

Not everyone can wank to the power trip of ruining an entire country's wank, like the politicians do.

Wise words though you might be able to live out the fantasy in the Tropico games idk off the top of my head.

I use the same sites as always, but have to Fly To Ireland* first. _ *fire up Mullvad

Oh, good shout. I normally nip across to New York when I'm wanting to prepare Special Interest websites, but the latency sucks. A jaunt over to the Emerald Isle might make a nice change.

I have Mullvad set to fire up automatically when I restart my Mac. Forgot about that when I was having issues with my broadcasting setup a few weeks back, and didn't realise until I was 20 minutes into my 2 hour radio show that I was broadcasting from Croatia.

Turns out Croatia's network is pretty steady.

Any recommendations 🥲?

How to grow a black market, part 1:

oh, would you look at that, banning something only made it unregulatable. I'm sure this has never happened before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTJvdGcb7Fs

Half of Brits or half of Brits who watch porn? Having 50% of the population navigate the internet with competence is laudable, given the age distribution.